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Post Info TOPIC: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
JW


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RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
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MaeBea wrote:
JW wrote:
Micky wrote:

I'm not going to post the whole thing.  You can read it and see it on this site. 

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


 

Unfortunately, that is not a birth certificate as has been pointed out before.  It is a substitution document that merely says he's registered at the court house.  It says nothing about WHERE he was born.

He could end all the speculation and put egg on the face of every Birther... or on the voter's, if he would just show the original.


 I don't know what pictures you're looking at, but the ones I'm looking at from the above link clearly state his Place of Birth as Honolulu, on the Island of Ohau, in the County of Honolulu.

I don't know what more anyone else would need.

 

 

 



-- Edited by MaeBea on Thursday 24th of March 2011 10:44:50 PM


 

 What they need is an actual birth certificate.  Obama could present it at any time to satisfy his critics.  He has chosen not to do so and a lot of people are asking, why?

Nothing it says on that substitute document is original and nothing on there was prepared by an unimpeachable source.



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signature.jpgdean wrote:

"Mr. Walrus, it has that certification as a true and correct copy, along with the seal of the clerk."

Okay, but they usually have a signature of the clerk at the time it's issued, stating, in part "I hereby certify on such and such a date...".  That shows that it's certified by a real person of authority, and is not just a printed form that anyone can make up.

If that's all they use in Hawaii, then fine.  That issue has never been one worth arguing about, at least to me.  I was more interested in the competency of the form.


 I'm confused as to what you are saying Dean.  It does have the signature (stamped) and the words "I certify that this is a true or abstract copy of..."

Is that what you mean?

 



-- Edited by MaeBea on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:09:59 AM

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RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
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JW wrote:
MaeBea wrote:
JW wrote:
Micky wrote:

I'm not going to post the whole thing.  You can read it and see it on this site. 

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


 

Unfortunately, that is not a birth certificate as has been pointed out before.  It is a substitution document that merely says he's registered at the court house.  It says nothing about WHERE he was born.

He could end all the speculation and put egg on the face of every Birther... or on the voter's, if he would just show the original.


 I don't know what pictures you're looking at, but the ones I'm looking at from the above link clearly state his Place of Birth as Honolulu, on the Island of Ohau, in the County of Honolulu.

I don't know what more anyone else would need.

 

 

 



-- Edited by MaeBea on Thursday 24th of March 2011 10:44:50 PM


 

 What they need is an actual birth certificate.  Obama could present it at any time to satisfy his critics.  He has chosen not to do so and a lot of people are asking, why?

Nothing it says on that substitute document is original and nothing on there was prepared by an unimpeachable source.


 an unimpeachable source.....

 

 

astounding....

 

 

come on now, what is an unimpeachable source?

 

you?

 

or you before you got retarded?

 



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Zeus Thunderpants wrote:

bollocks

 

 

anyone anywhere is allowed to purchase a copy of anyones birth certificate, how the hell do you think companies trace family trees for you, but surprisingly Obamas is off limits.

 


 Oh no, you cannot purchase a copy of someones birth certificate in the US, at least.  The only one allowed is you, the parents, or a legal representative of yours.

 



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Ok 

 

but not so in the UK, a friend of mine bought mine in the uk and posted it to me last year, anyone can buy a copy. Thats how firms charge to trace your geneology, costs about 25 quid a certificate.



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JW


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Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
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KittyBiggerstaff wrote:
JW wrote:
Micky wrote:

I'm not going to post the whole thing.  You can read it and see it on this site. 

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


 

Unfortunately, that is not a birth certificate as has been pointed out before.  It is a substitution document that merely says he's registered at the court house.  It says nothing about WHERE he was born.

He could end all the speculation and put egg on the face of every Birther... or on the voter's, if he would just show the original.


I can't be arsed, as our British members say, going through this again, but to keep it as brief as possible--the document that's mailed to our parents a few weeks after we're born is actually a Certificate of Registration of Birth.  Apparently it certifies that the actual birth certificate is on file and has been registered at whatever state agency handles such things, but it's not The Birth Certificate.

As I wrote back in the old 'hood, I discovered this in the summer of 2009, when I was closing in on age 65 and needed to apply for Medicare.  That procedure required my obtaining a validated copy of my actual birth certificate, NOT the certificate of registration of it, and let me tell you, the b.c. contained a lot more information than the c.o.r. did.

It was quite a project proving I am who I am just to obtain the validated copy of the b.c. (I ordered two, second and subsequent copies were only $2 each).

Up until that momentous occasion, though, my very pretty pink Certificate of Registration of Birth served me well--I used to it to apply for a Social Security number, get a driver's license, get married, spend a weekend in Bimini, and I forget what all else.

Bottom line--I think the "birthers" are assholes, but I also think Obama's an ass for not requesting the state of Hawaii to release the document for all the world to see once and forever.  He, and probably he alone, can request it, receive it, make it public, and finally quash all the crap.

The longer he delays this, the more suspicion festers.

 

 


 

 You are absolutely correct on every point except your assessment of the "Birthers".  Since it is a Constitutional requirement that the President be born in the USA, any voter has the right to insist on seeing the original... and quite, frankly, the US Elections Commission had the obligation to certify his candidacy and that requires an official original if any question exists.

Based on his and his mother's known history, I don't doubt his place of birth being as stated because he has been elected and at this point, the issue is moot.  I would bet the reason he won't show it is that it lists no father's name.

 

Bottom line, if you choose to become a public political figure, you have no right to withhold any information requested by any legal voter.



-- Edited by JW on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:17:38 AM

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RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
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Zeus Thunderpants wrote:

Ok 

 

but not so in the UK, a friend of mine bought mine in the uk and posted it to me last year, anyone can buy a copy. Thats how firms charge to trace your geneology, costs about 25 quid a certificate.


 You should have known that Ed.  If what you said was true, all those birthers would have Obamas certificate in their hands right now, or would be crowing about how they couldn't get it because it didn't exist.

 



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JW


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KittyBiggerstaff wrote:

I will once again bring up (and then toddle on to noddle land) the point that Barack Obama's mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, was born in Wichita, Kansas, (according to Wiki, but I don't think there's any doubt that she was born somewhere within the United States).

Essentially, since she was a citizen of the U.S. it wouldn't have mattered diddly-damn where in the world she happened to be when she gave birth.  Her child would be a U.S. citizen.

At best, he would've enjoyed dual citizenship if he'd been born outside of the U.S. and its territories.

Hey, there's plenty to argue about regarding his policies, but picking on his "pedigree" makes the pickers look utterly stupid.

 


 

 It doesn't matter that he is a US citizen, and again, no one doubts that, no one competent.  The constitution requires that he be born within the confines of the United States of America.



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RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
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JW wrote:
KittyBiggerstaff wrote:
JW wrote:
Micky wrote:

I'm not going to post the whole thing.  You can read it and see it on this site. 

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


 

Unfortunately, that is not a birth certificate as has been pointed out before.  It is a substitution document that merely says he's registered at the court house.  It says nothing about WHERE he was born.

He could end all the speculation and put egg on the face of every Birther... or on the voter's, if he would just show the original.


I can't be arsed, as our British members say, going through this again, but to keep it as brief as possible--the document that's mailed to our parents a few weeks after we're born is actually a Certificate of Registration of Birth.  Apparently it certifies that the actual birth certificate is on file and has been registered at whatever state agency handles such things, but it's not The Birth Certificate.

As I wrote back in the old 'hood, I discovered this in the summer of 2009, when I was closing in on age 65 and needed to apply for Medicare.  That procedure required my obtaining a validated copy of my actual birth certificate, NOT the certificate of registration of it, and let me tell you, the b.c. contained a lot more information than the c.o.r. did.

It was quite a project proving I am who I am just to obtain the validated copy of the b.c. (I ordered two, second and subsequent copies were only $2 each).

Up until that momentous occasion, though, my very pretty pink Certificate of Registration of Birth served me well--I used to it to apply for a Social Security number, get a driver's license, get married, spend a weekend in Bimini, and I forget what all else.

Bottom line--I think the "birthers" are assholes, but I also think Obama's an ass for not requesting the state of Hawaii to release the document for all the world to see once and forever.  He, and probably he alone, can request it, receive it, make it public, and finally quash all the crap.

The longer he delays this, the more suspicion festers.

 

 


 

 You are absolutely correct on every point except your assessment of the "Birthers".  Since it is a Constitutional requirement that the President be born in the USA, any voter has the right to insist on seeing the original... and quite, frankly, the US Elections Commission had the obligation to certify his candidacy and that requires an official original if any question exists.

Based on his and his mother's known history, I don't doubt his place of birth being as stated because he has been elected and at this point, the issue is moot.  I would bet the reason he won't show it is that it lists no father's name.

 

Bottom line, if you choose to become a public political figure, you have no right to withhold any information requested by any legal voter.



-- Edited by JW on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:17:38 AM


 shove this up your ass.....

 

 

Barack Obama (born 1961), 44th president of the United States, was born in Honolulu, Hawaii to a U.S. citizen mother and a British subject father from what was then the Kenya Colony of the United Kingdom (which became the independent country of Kenya in 1963). Before and after the 2008 presidential election, arguments were made that he is not a natural born citizen. On June 12, 2008, the Obama presidential campaign launched a website to counter what it described as smears by his opponents, including these challenges to his eligibility.[75] The most prominent issue raised against Obama was the claim made in several lawsuits that he was not actually born inHawaii. In two other lawsuits, the plaintiffs argued that it was irrelevant whether he was born in Hawaii,[76] but argued instead that he was nevertheless not a natural born citizen because his citizenship status at birth was governed by the British Nationality Act of 1948.[77] The relevant courts have either denied all applications or declined to render a judgment due to lack of jurisdiction. Some of the cases have been dismissed because of the plaintiff's lack of standing.[36] On July 28, 2009, Hawaii Health Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino issued a statement saying, "I ... have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen."[78] On July 27, 2009, the U.S. House of Representatives passed H.Res. 593, commemorating the 50th anniversary of Hawaii's statehood, including the text, "Whereas the 44th President of the United States, Barack Obama, was born in Hawaii on August 4, 1961."[79] The vote passed 378-0.[80]

 



__________________

uncertainty is an uncomfortable position.

but certainty is an absurd one...

 

Voltaire



Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 3251
Date:
RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
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JW wrote:
KittyBiggerstaff wrote:
JW wrote:
Micky wrote:

I'm not going to post the whole thing.  You can read it and see it on this site. 

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


 

Unfortunately, that is not a birth certificate as has been pointed out before.  It is a substitution document that merely says he's registered at the court house.  It says nothing about WHERE he was born.

He could end all the speculation and put egg on the face of every Birther... or on the voter's, if he would just show the original.


I can't be arsed, as our British members say, going through this again, but to keep it as brief as possible--the document that's mailed to our parents a few weeks after we're born is actually a Certificate of Registration of Birth.  Apparently it certifies that the actual birth certificate is on file and has been registered at whatever state agency handles such things, but it's not The Birth Certificate.

As I wrote back in the old 'hood, I discovered this in the summer of 2009, when I was closing in on age 65 and needed to apply for Medicare.  That procedure required my obtaining a validated copy of my actual birth certificate, NOT the certificate of registration of it, and let me tell you, the b.c. contained a lot more information than the c.o.r. did.

It was quite a project proving I am who I am just to obtain the validated copy of the b.c. (I ordered two, second and subsequent copies were only $2 each).

Up until that momentous occasion, though, my very pretty pink Certificate of Registration of Birth served me well--I used to it to apply for a Social Security number, get a driver's license, get married, spend a weekend in Bimini, and I forget what all else.

Bottom line--I think the "birthers" are assholes, but I also think Obama's an ass for not requesting the state of Hawaii to release the document for all the world to see once and forever.  He, and probably he alone, can request it, receive it, make it public, and finally quash all the crap.

The longer he delays this, the more suspicion festers.

 

 


 

 You are absolutely correct on every point except your assessment of the "Birthers".  Since it is a Constitutional requirement that the President be born in the USA, any voter has the right to insist on seeing the original... and quite, frankly, the US Elections Commission had the obligation to certify his candidacy and that requires an official original if any question exists.

Based on his and his mother's known history, I don't doubt his place of birth being as stated because he has been elected and at this point, the issue is moot.  I would bet the reason he won't show it is that it lists no father's name.

 

Bottom line, if you choose to become a public political figure, you have no right to withhold any information requested by any legal voter.



-- Edited by JW on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:17:38 AM


 Oh.

My.

God.

No one gives up their right to privacy to run for public office.  What fascist state do you live in? 

BTW, that certificate in the pictures is exactly what anyone would get when asking for a copy of their birth certificate.  No one gets the original, that stays in the records.  You get only a copy of one.  Had the original not stated his fathers name, neither would this short form copy.  That is how they come.  I suggest you send for yours.  Oh wait, you weren't born in the US, so it doesn't matter.

Unimpeachable source.  Jesus H. Keeriste On A Stick.

 



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RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
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It's a moot point anyhow as long as his  allegiance is wholly to america, and I think he's proved himself wholly an american politician what with his u turns of guan and his commitment to send in more troops abroad et al.

 

He is a legitimate president, certainly not one of the best but history will sugar coat him because he was the first black one, i still think Hillary was a better option. The trouble that I can see is while he has proved a pretty ineffective president, theres no one else with his charisma to defeat him in an election, sure there are better politicians but no one with public appeal to the masses, its a sad fact of politics that people vote for personalities rather than policies.

 

But JW is right, once you become a high profile politician, the public have a right to know everything about you, and lets face it Obama is making shit loads of money from his position, so cough up the goods that are demanded (birth certificate) or get the fuck out of office.

 



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Divide By Cucumber Error. Please Reinstall Universe And Reboot

JW


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Status: Offline
Posts: 411
Date:
RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
Permalink  
 


MaeBea wrote:
JW wrote:
KittyBiggerstaff wrote:
JW wrote:
Micky wrote:

I'm not going to post the whole thing.  You can read it and see it on this site. 

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


 

Unfortunately, that is not a birth certificate as has been pointed out before.  It is a substitution document that merely says he's registered at the court house.  It says nothing about WHERE he was born.

He could end all the speculation and put egg on the face of every Birther... or on the voter's, if he would just show the original.


I can't be arsed, as our British members say, going through this again, but to keep it as brief as possible--the document that's mailed to our parents a few weeks after we're born is actually a Certificate of Registration of Birth.  Apparently it certifies that the actual birth certificate is on file and has been registered at whatever state agency handles such things, but it's not The Birth Certificate.

As I wrote back in the old 'hood, I discovered this in the summer of 2009, when I was closing in on age 65 and needed to apply for Medicare.  That procedure required my obtaining a validated copy of my actual birth certificate, NOT the certificate of registration of it, and let me tell you, the b.c. contained a lot more information than the c.o.r. did.

It was quite a project proving I am who I am just to obtain the validated copy of the b.c. (I ordered two, second and subsequent copies were only $2 each).

Up until that momentous occasion, though, my very pretty pink Certificate of Registration of Birth served me well--I used to it to apply for a Social Security number, get a driver's license, get married, spend a weekend in Bimini, and I forget what all else.

Bottom line--I think the "birthers" are assholes, but I also think Obama's an ass for not requesting the state of Hawaii to release the document for all the world to see once and forever.  He, and probably he alone, can request it, receive it, make it public, and finally quash all the crap.

The longer he delays this, the more suspicion festers.

 

 


 

 You are absolutely correct on every point except your assessment of the "Birthers".  Since it is a Constitutional requirement that the President be born in the USA, any voter has the right to insist on seeing the original... and quite, frankly, the US Elections Commission had the obligation to certify his candidacy and that requires an official original if any question exists.

Based on his and his mother's known history, I don't doubt his place of birth being as stated because he has been elected and at this point, the issue is moot.  I would bet the reason he won't show it is that it lists no father's name.

 

Bottom line, if you choose to become a public political figure, you have no right to withhold any information requested by any legal voter.



-- Edited by JW on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:17:38 AM


 Oh.

My.

God.

No one gives up their right to privacy to run for public office.  What fascist state do you live in? 

BTW, that certificate in the pictures is exactly what anyone would get when asking for a copy of their birth certificate.  No one gets the original, that stays in the records.  You get only a copy of one.  Had the original not stated his fathers name, neither would this short form copy.  That is how they come.  I suggest you send for yours.  Oh wait, you weren't born in the US, so it doesn't matter.

Unimpeachable source.  Jesus H. Keeriste On A Stick.

 


 

 I have copies of the originals of all three of my children.  I have copies of the original of my own.  My kids were born in the USA.

 

The only unimpeachable source is the original document signed and dated by the registrar, based on information supplied by the hospital at the time of the child's birth.



__________________
JW


Full Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 411
Date:
Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
Permalink  
 


JW wrote:
MaeBea wrote:
JW wrote:
KittyBiggerstaff wrote:
JW wrote:
Micky wrote:

I'm not going to post the whole thing.  You can read it and see it on this site. 

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


 

Unfortunately, that is not a birth certificate as has been pointed out before.  It is a substitution document that merely says he's registered at the court house.  It says nothing about WHERE he was born.

He could end all the speculation and put egg on the face of every Birther... or on the voter's, if he would just show the original.


I can't be arsed, as our British members say, going through this again, but to keep it as brief as possible--the document that's mailed to our parents a few weeks after we're born is actually a Certificate of Registration of Birth.  Apparently it certifies that the actual birth certificate is on file and has been registered at whatever state agency handles such things, but it's not The Birth Certificate.

As I wrote back in the old 'hood, I discovered this in the summer of 2009, when I was closing in on age 65 and needed to apply for Medicare.  That procedure required my obtaining a validated copy of my actual birth certificate, NOT the certificate of registration of it, and let me tell you, the b.c. contained a lot more information than the c.o.r. did.

It was quite a project proving I am who I am just to obtain the validated copy of the b.c. (I ordered two, second and subsequent copies were only $2 each).

Up until that momentous occasion, though, my very pretty pink Certificate of Registration of Birth served me well--I used to it to apply for a Social Security number, get a driver's license, get married, spend a weekend in Bimini, and I forget what all else.

Bottom line--I think the "birthers" are assholes, but I also think Obama's an ass for not requesting the state of Hawaii to release the document for all the world to see once and forever.  He, and probably he alone, can request it, receive it, make it public, and finally quash all the crap.

The longer he delays this, the more suspicion festers.

 

 


 

 You are absolutely correct on every point except your assessment of the "Birthers".  Since it is a Constitutional requirement that the President be born in the USA, any voter has the right to insist on seeing the original... and quite, frankly, the US Elections Commission had the obligation to certify his candidacy and that requires an official original if any question exists.

Based on his and his mother's known history, I don't doubt his place of birth being as stated because he has been elected and at this point, the issue is moot.  I would bet the reason he won't show it is that it lists no father's name.

 

Bottom line, if you choose to become a public political figure, you have no right to withhold any information requested by any legal voter.



-- Edited by JW on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:17:38 AM


 Oh.

My.

God.

No one gives up their right to privacy to run for public office.  What fascist state do you live in? 

BTW, that certificate in the pictures is exactly what anyone would get when asking for a copy of their birth certificate.  No one gets the original, that stays in the records.  You get only a copy of one.  Had the original not stated his fathers name, neither would this short form copy.  That is how they come.  I suggest you send for yours.  Oh wait, you weren't born in the US, so it doesn't matter.

Unimpeachable source.  Jesus H. Keeriste On A Stick.

 


 

 I have copies of the originals of all three of my children.  I have copies of the original of my own.  My kids were born in the USA.

 

The only unimpeachable source is the original document signed and dated by the registrar, based on information supplied by the hospital at the time of the child's birth.


 

 Adding this:  I have copies of my siblings' original birth certificates, one from WI and two from MN.



-- Edited by JW on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:35:09 AM

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RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
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MaeBea wrote:
signature.jpgdean wrote:

"Mr. Walrus, it has that certification as a true and correct copy, along with the seal of the clerk."

Okay, but they usually have a signature of the clerk at the time it's issued, stating, in part "I hereby certify on such and such a date...".  That shows that it's certified by a real person of authority, and is not just a printed form that anyone can make up.

If that's all they use in Hawaii, then fine.  That issue has never been one worth arguing about, at least to me.  I was more interested in the competency of the form.


 I'm confused as to what you are saying Dean.  It does have the signature (stamped) and the words "I certify that this is a true or abstract copy of..."

Is that what you mean?

 



-- Edited by MaeBea on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:09:59 AM


 That is exactly what I mean, Mae.  Maybe my eyes just overlooked it, but if a statement such as that, in that form, were shown, I would agree with you.  The signature, or even a facsimile of it, and the date of certification is what make it authentic.

I'm really not looking to argue that Obama is not a citizen, but if evidence of citizenship is going to be shown, I just want it to be authentic.

 



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RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
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dean wrote:
MaeBea wrote:
signature.jpgdean wrote:

"Mr. Walrus, it has that certification as a true and correct copy, along with the seal of the clerk."

Okay, but they usually have a signature of the clerk at the time it's issued, stating, in part "I hereby certify on such and such a date...".  That shows that it's certified by a real person of authority, and is not just a printed form that anyone can make up.

If that's all they use in Hawaii, then fine.  That issue has never been one worth arguing about, at least to me.  I was more interested in the competency of the form.


 I'm confused as to what you are saying Dean.  It does have the signature (stamped) and the words "I certify that this is a true or abstract copy of..."

Is that what you mean?

 



-- Edited by MaeBea on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:09:59 AM


 That is exactly what I mean, Mae.  Maybe my eyes just overlooked it, but if a statement such as that, in that form, were shown, I would agree with you.  The signature, or even a facsimile of it, and the date of certification is what make it authentic.

I'm really not looking to argue that Obama is not a citizen, but if evidence of citizenship is going to be shown, I just want it to be authentic.

 


 Okay, I was just a bit confused.  I thought you had sreen that and it wasn't good enough.  I see we're in agreement now.

Yes, we all want the evidence to be authentic.  I really don't think that he has to prove anything more to anyone.  That document says it all, imo.

 



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RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
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JW wrote:
MaeBea wrote:
JW wrote:
KittyBiggerstaff wrote:
JW wrote:
Micky wrote:

I'm not going to post the whole thing.  You can read it and see it on this site. 

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


 

Unfortunately, that is not a birth certificate as has been pointed out before.  It is a substitution document that merely says he's registered at the court house.  It says nothing about WHERE he was born.

He could end all the speculation and put egg on the face of every Birther... or on the voter's, if he would just show the original.


I can't be arsed, as our British members say, going through this again, but to keep it as brief as possible--the document that's mailed to our parents a few weeks after we're born is actually a Certificate of Registration of Birth.  Apparently it certifies that the actual birth certificate is on file and has been registered at whatever state agency handles such things, but it's not The Birth Certificate.

As I wrote back in the old 'hood, I discovered this in the summer of 2009, when I was closing in on age 65 and needed to apply for Medicare.  That procedure required my obtaining a validated copy of my actual birth certificate, NOT the certificate of registration of it, and let me tell you, the b.c. contained a lot more information than the c.o.r. did.

It was quite a project proving I am who I am just to obtain the validated copy of the b.c. (I ordered two, second and subsequent copies were only $2 each).

Up until that momentous occasion, though, my very pretty pink Certificate of Registration of Birth served me well--I used to it to apply for a Social Security number, get a driver's license, get married, spend a weekend in Bimini, and I forget what all else.

Bottom line--I think the "birthers" are assholes, but I also think Obama's an ass for not requesting the state of Hawaii to release the document for all the world to see once and forever.  He, and probably he alone, can request it, receive it, make it public, and finally quash all the crap.

The longer he delays this, the more suspicion festers.

 

 


 

 You are absolutely correct on every point except your assessment of the "Birthers".  Since it is a Constitutional requirement that the President be born in the USA, any voter has the right to insist on seeing the original... and quite, frankly, the US Elections Commission had the obligation to certify his candidacy and that requires an official original if any question exists.

Based on his and his mother's known history, I don't doubt his place of birth being as stated because he has been elected and at this point, the issue is moot.  I would bet the reason he won't show it is that it lists no father's name.

 

Bottom line, if you choose to become a public political figure, you have no right to withhold any information requested by any legal voter.



-- Edited by JW on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:17:38 AM


 Oh.

My.

God.

No one gives up their right to privacy to run for public office.  What fascist state do you live in? 

BTW, that certificate in the pictures is exactly what anyone would get when asking for a copy of their birth certificate.  No one gets the original, that stays in the records.  You get only a copy of one.  Had the original not stated his fathers name, neither would this short form copy.  That is how they come.  I suggest you send for yours.  Oh wait, you weren't born in the US, so it doesn't matter.

Unimpeachable source.  Jesus H. Keeriste On A Stick.

 


 

 I have copies of the originals of all three of my children.  I have copies of the original of my own.  My kids were born in the USA.

 

The only unimpeachable source is the original document signed and dated by the registrar, based on information supplied by the hospital at the time of the child's birth.


 Yeah, you have copies.  Try to get the original and see where that gets you.

Sorry, but you are wrong about it being "unimpeachable".  The signed, sealed, notarized copy is unimpeachable (if you want to use that word) in ANY court of law in the US.  You should know that.

 



__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 3251
Date:
RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
Permalink  
 


JW wrote:
JW wrote:
MaeBea wrote:
JW wrote:
KittyBiggerstaff wrote:
JW wrote:
Micky wrote:

I'm not going to post the whole thing.  You can read it and see it on this site. 

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


 

Unfortunately, that is not a birth certificate as has been pointed out before.  It is a substitution document that merely says he's registered at the court house.  It says nothing about WHERE he was born.

He could end all the speculation and put egg on the face of every Birther... or on the voter's, if he would just show the original.


I can't be arsed, as our British members say, going through this again, but to keep it as brief as possible--the document that's mailed to our parents a few weeks after we're born is actually a Certificate of Registration of Birth.  Apparently it certifies that the actual birth certificate is on file and has been registered at whatever state agency handles such things, but it's not The Birth Certificate.

As I wrote back in the old 'hood, I discovered this in the summer of 2009, when I was closing in on age 65 and needed to apply for Medicare.  That procedure required my obtaining a validated copy of my actual birth certificate, NOT the certificate of registration of it, and let me tell you, the b.c. contained a lot more information than the c.o.r. did.

It was quite a project proving I am who I am just to obtain the validated copy of the b.c. (I ordered two, second and subsequent copies were only $2 each).

Up until that momentous occasion, though, my very pretty pink Certificate of Registration of Birth served me well--I used to it to apply for a Social Security number, get a driver's license, get married, spend a weekend in Bimini, and I forget what all else.

Bottom line--I think the "birthers" are assholes, but I also think Obama's an ass for not requesting the state of Hawaii to release the document for all the world to see once and forever.  He, and probably he alone, can request it, receive it, make it public, and finally quash all the crap.

The longer he delays this, the more suspicion festers.

 

 


 

 You are absolutely correct on every point except your assessment of the "Birthers".  Since it is a Constitutional requirement that the President be born in the USA, any voter has the right to insist on seeing the original... and quite, frankly, the US Elections Commission had the obligation to certify his candidacy and that requires an official original if any question exists.

Based on his and his mother's known history, I don't doubt his place of birth being as stated because he has been elected and at this point, the issue is moot.  I would bet the reason he won't show it is that it lists no father's name.

 

Bottom line, if you choose to become a public political figure, you have no right to withhold any information requested by any legal voter.



-- Edited by JW on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:17:38 AM


 Oh.

My.

God.

No one gives up their right to privacy to run for public office.  What fascist state do you live in? 

BTW, that certificate in the pictures is exactly what anyone would get when asking for a copy of their birth certificate.  No one gets the original, that stays in the records.  You get only a copy of one.  Had the original not stated his fathers name, neither would this short form copy.  That is how they come.  I suggest you send for yours.  Oh wait, you weren't born in the US, so it doesn't matter.

Unimpeachable source.  Jesus H. Keeriste On A Stick.

 


 

 I have copies of the originals of all three of my children.  I have copies of the original of my own.  My kids were born in the USA.

 

The only unimpeachable source is the original document signed and dated by the registrar, based on information supplied by the hospital at the time of the child's birth.


 

 Adding this:  I have copies of my siblings' original birth certificates, one from WI and two from MN.



-- Edited by JW on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:35:09 AM


 So what?  You're acting as if that is something that proves your point.  It has nothing to do with your point.

 



__________________


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Status: Offline
Posts: 3579
Date:
RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
Permalink  
 


JW wrote:
KittyBiggerstaff wrote:

I will once again bring up (and then toddle on to noddle land) the point that Barack Obama's mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, was born in Wichita, Kansas, (according to Wiki, but I don't think there's any doubt that she was born somewhere within the United States).

Essentially, since she was a citizen of the U.S. it wouldn't have mattered diddly-damn where in the world she happened to be when she gave birth.  Her child would be a U.S. citizen.

At best, he would've enjoyed dual citizenship if he'd been born outside of the U.S. and its territories.

Hey, there's plenty to argue about regarding his policies, but picking on his "pedigree" makes the pickers look utterly stupid.

 


 

 It doesn't matter that he is a US citizen, and again, no one doubts that, no one competent.  The constitution requires that he be born within the confines of the United States of America.


 No it doesn't you forget it was changed to allow McCain who was born in the Panama to run for president. However there was another who was an American citizen but not born technically in the US,  Goldwater, in that Arizona was not a state when he was born. The law now is that in order to be a US citizen one parent must be a citizen, and as has been pointed out Obama's mother was a citizen.

 



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 Are you sufficiently frightened now? Trump wants you to be.

 
 

 

JW


Full Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 411
Date:
RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
Permalink  
 


MaeBea wrote:
JW wrote:
MaeBea wrote:
JW wrote:
KittyBiggerstaff wrote:
JW wrote:
Micky wrote:

I'm not going to post the whole thing.  You can read it and see it on this site. 

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


 

Unfortunately, that is not a birth certificate as has been pointed out before.  It is a substitution document that merely says he's registered at the court house.  It says nothing about WHERE he was born.

He could end all the speculation and put egg on the face of every Birther... or on the voter's, if he would just show the original.


I can't be arsed, as our British members say, going through this again, but to keep it as brief as possible--the document that's mailed to our parents a few weeks after we're born is actually a Certificate of Registration of Birth.  Apparently it certifies that the actual birth certificate is on file and has been registered at whatever state agency handles such things, but it's not The Birth Certificate.

As I wrote back in the old 'hood, I discovered this in the summer of 2009, when I was closing in on age 65 and needed to apply for Medicare.  That procedure required my obtaining a validated copy of my actual birth certificate, NOT the certificate of registration of it, and let me tell you, the b.c. contained a lot more information than the c.o.r. did.

It was quite a project proving I am who I am just to obtain the validated copy of the b.c. (I ordered two, second and subsequent copies were only $2 each).

Up until that momentous occasion, though, my very pretty pink Certificate of Registration of Birth served me well--I used to it to apply for a Social Security number, get a driver's license, get married, spend a weekend in Bimini, and I forget what all else.

Bottom line--I think the "birthers" are assholes, but I also think Obama's an ass for not requesting the state of Hawaii to release the document for all the world to see once and forever.  He, and probably he alone, can request it, receive it, make it public, and finally quash all the crap.

The longer he delays this, the more suspicion festers.

 

 


 

 You are absolutely correct on every point except your assessment of the "Birthers".  Since it is a Constitutional requirement that the President be born in the USA, any voter has the right to insist on seeing the original... and quite, frankly, the US Elections Commission had the obligation to certify his candidacy and that requires an official original if any question exists.

Based on his and his mother's known history, I don't doubt his place of birth being as stated because he has been elected and at this point, the issue is moot.  I would bet the reason he won't show it is that it lists no father's name.

 

Bottom line, if you choose to become a public political figure, you have no right to withhold any information requested by any legal voter.



-- Edited by JW on Friday 25th of March 2011 12:17:38 AM


 Oh.

My.

God.

No one gives up their right to privacy to run for public office.  What fascist state do you live in? 

BTW, that certificate in the pictures is exactly what anyone would get when asking for a copy of their birth certificate.  No one gets the original, that stays in the records.  You get only a copy of one.  Had the original not stated his fathers name, neither would this short form copy.  That is how they come.  I suggest you send for yours.  Oh wait, you weren't born in the US, so it doesn't matter.

Unimpeachable source.  Jesus H. Keeriste On A Stick.

 


 

 I have copies of the originals of all three of my children.  I have copies of the original of my own.  My kids were born in the USA.

 

The only unimpeachable source is the original document signed and dated by the registrar, based on information supplied by the hospital at the time of the child's birth.


 Yeah, you have copies.  Try to get the original and see where that gets you.

Sorry, but you are wrong about it being "unimpeachable".  The signed, sealed, notarized copy is unimpeachable (if you want to use that word) in ANY court of law in the US.  You should know that.

 


 

 I said I have copies of the originals, Mae.  They include all of the entries made at the time of birth, hospital, attending physician, weight, height, mother, father, time of birth, etc.  Not some flimsey knock-off that says nothing but, duh, yup, I wuz borned.

What Obama presented is NOT a copy of the original.  It is a sustitute document in lieu of a copy of the original.

 

If Obama was white and Republican, I gay-ron-tee you would be demanding better proof.



__________________
JW


Full Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 411
Date:
RE: Obama's birth certificate..read it and weep birthers
Permalink  
 


suzi wrote:
JW wrote:
KittyBiggerstaff wrote:

I will once again bring up (and then toddle on to noddle land) the point that Barack Obama's mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, was born in Wichita, Kansas, (according to Wiki, but I don't think there's any doubt that she was born somewhere within the United States).

Essentially, since she was a citizen of the U.S. it wouldn't have mattered diddly-damn where in the world she happened to be when she gave birth.  Her child would be a U.S. citizen.

At best, he would've enjoyed dual citizenship if he'd been born outside of the U.S. and its territories.

Hey, there's plenty to argue about regarding his policies, but picking on his "pedigree" makes the pickers look utterly stupid.

 


 

 It doesn't matter that he is a US citizen, and again, no one doubts that, no one competent.  The constitution requires that he be born within the confines of the United States of America.


 No it doesn't you forget it was changed to allow McCain who was born in the Panama to run for president. However there was another who was an American citizen but not born technically in the US,  Goldwater, in that Arizona was not a state when he was born. The law now is that in order to be a US citizen one parent must be a citizen, and as has been pointed out Obama's mother was a citizen.

 


 

 suzi, try to understand this, the US Constitution requires that the President be born on US soil.  No law can countermand that but a Constitutional amendment.  No such amendment has ever been passed and only recently proposed.

It doesn't matter that a person is a US citizen.  Many US citizens are not eligible to be President because they were not born on US soil.

McCain is eligible because he was born in a US military hospital in the Panama Canal Zone, to American citizen parents while the canal zone was US controlled property, considered by law to be American soil, just like US embassies.  US territories, not protectorates but territories, have always been regarded as US soil.  Goldwater was not an issue for that reason.

If Obama showed a birth certificate that showed the hospital he was born in and it was in Hawaii, even if then a territory, no one would have an argument of any kind.  The argument the Birthers make is not that Obama is not a citizen, everone knows he is a US citizen; the argument is that he doesn't meet the Constitutional requirements to be President.

How anyone can object to absolute verification of that is beyond me.  If a question exists, Obama can settle it very easily by showing a copy of his original birth certificate.



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